We Talk Fantasy Sports trades away
2020 2nd Round Pick
I like this trade for We Talk Fantasy Sports because a second round pick is likely to amount to nothing*, although it is less likely to amount to nothing when made by Hustle Loyalty Respect (“the greatest fantasy baseball prospector of his generation” – Steve Fernsler, 2019), while Steven Matz will score points. So there’s that. I like that this move signals WTFS is at least trying to be competitive (bold and daring!) in 2020 instead of mailing it in. Maybe he should probably keep dumping mid-round picks for decent guys and see what happens. I feel like if you spend two random hours in June researching prospects, you can probably find a guy on waivers comparable to whoever you’d get in the second round anyway. I mean, I picked up Pedro Miguel Martinez from the free agent scrap heap and now he’s getting lots of hype on prospect Twitter and appearing on all the dynasty top-100 lists.
* The best second rounders in 2019 were renowned slap dick prospect Xavier Edwards (he will be a stud if we change our scoring to make stolen bases worth 50 points a piece), Tristan Casas, and Alek Thomas, and the latter is mostly valuable because he was traded straight up for a $22 player that scores 800+ points every year and now gets to play all his home games in baseball’s second friendliest hitter’s park. Wander Franco was a second rounder in 2018 though.
Anyway, the trade is fine overall, I will just take the side that is adding a player that will score points in 2020. Good job, Keith. Okay job, Jonny. Have a good day.
Marshall Law trades away
Marsh, Brandon($0 Prospect) 2021 Draft Pick, Round 3 (We Talk Fantasy Sports) 2020 Draft Pick, Round 1 (Marshall Law)
Lynch, Daniel ($0 Prospect)
TBD trades away
Altuve, Jose ($67) 2021 Draft Pick, Round 4 (The Foundation)
Hustle’s Toxic $.02
Trade actually seems pretty good for Marshall I think. Jose Altuve is expensive, but not THAT expensive like some guys are, and he’s the top 2bman in the game, and somehow still in his 20s. He should be elite for a couple years and at currently one of the more scarce positions. TBD has certainly rebuilt their farm in a few trades. Brandon Marsh, former HLR legend, is someone I like but probably not anything too special. He gets Jayson Werth comps, so that would be his upside. Lynch is certainly one of the better SP prospects and they get the 5th overall pick too, which probably nets them someone pretty decent. I kinda think I would have punted someone besides Altuve for prospects, but I’m not intimately familiar with TBD’s roster salary-wise and how much they needed to cut. That’s someone else’s job.
Marshall got a lot of prospects and then traded a bunch away (still having many good ones) to compete for 2020 and has lapped many teams who have yet to make playoffs. I rank Marshall’s team close to 6 in my Power Ranking (full rankings available to Hustle Media subscribers), which is a good spot to be in heading into 2020.
Congrats to Marshall on the acquisition of 2019 World Series Runner-Up Jose Altuve and another future shitpick. From the perspective of acquiring fantasy baseball points for your fantasy baseball team, I think this is a great deal for you. All adding 2019 World Series Runner-Up Jose Altuve cost here was two fringe prospects, a meaningless 2021 draft pick, and most of all… the fifth overall pick this year and your choice of CJ Abrams or Riley Greene. Oh man. I know who I’d choose.
Yesterday I commented on how diffiult it was to review my own trade. Today, I again tried to ask, “why would he do that,” and see both sides of the deal, but it was easier to form a solid opinion on this deal.
The Foundation – Jordan does this deal to get Frankie Montas, who has been very productive this year averaging 33.2 points per game. He will step in as The Foundation’s best pitcher when Hyun-Jin Ryu finds his way back to the injured list. I personally don’t think Montas has the talent to maintain this level of play, but Im wrong about players all the time. His numbers suggest there may be some regression coming, but nothing that Jordan will lose sleep over. Even with some regression, Montas should be an above average starting pitcher and a good acquistion to the Foundation.
The Foundation also adds Kyle Schwarber. The numbers on the back of Schwarber’s baseball card are kind of ugly. He also has a history of sitting against lefthanders. With all that said, a decent eye and the power he is known for has carried him to a 5.15ppg average making him a decent LF option for the Foundation, who just lost LF Andrew McCutchen for the year. His $36 price tag puts him on the cut bubble, but Jordan can worry about that later.
ORGANZIED CHAOS- Why would he do this? It’s either Ozzie Albies, or the desire to own the enitre Braves infield. Im not sure which Ozzie Albies Coach Swinson is actually getting here. Is it the man-child from the first half of last year, or the kid who is hitting .259/.318/.403 for the year? Grinders member Keith Lott of We Talk Fantasy Sports has a pretty strong opinion of Albies https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js” data-wplink-url-error=”true”>here. Im not that quick to write off a 22 year old with a once rated 70 hit tool but Im not sure he does enough other things to be the true fantasy star some people believe he still could be.
Chaos gets Justus Sheffield in the deal. I truely ask “why did he do that?” Sheffield has a devestating slider, but not much after that. He’s a top 100 prospect, in mulitlpe locations, but without significant improvement I cant see him having alot of success unless it’s in relief. Im afraid this might be a case of Coach Swinson trusting the lists, without additional homework.
Chaos got a 2nd rounder for a 4th rounder in this deal. It helps balance things a little.
SO WHO WON THE DEAL?
Jordan preaches winning now, and traded Albies’ potential (whatever it may be), for an above average starting pitcher and a useful LF. Coach gets a young 2B, and almost a monopoly of the Atlanta infield. Anyway I fernslice it, I prefer The Foundation’s side by a good bit.
Andrew’s thoughts: Wow, what an exciting turn of events. The race to be the Rockies’ first baseman seems to have ended, and Hustle Loyalty Respect’s Daniel Murphy is the lucky winner. Johnny Hustle be all like:
Literally overnight, Murphy’s value skyrocketed. His Steamer projection went way, way up. Check this out:
For Hustle Loyalty Respect, this is a windfall. This is easily the greatest thing that’s happened in his franchise’s illustrious history. He “traded” literally nothing to land the DAMN Rockies first baseman. Truly incredible. We’re talking unprecedented luck here. I just love this “trade” for HLR. When you can add an asset like this in exchange for nothing… just, wow.
For We Talk Fantasy Sports, well, I don’t understand this “trade” at all. They are actually going to be paying Ian Desmond, back-up 1B and possible platoon LF, the only hitter to ever go to Coors Field and get significantly worse, $4 more than the actual Rockies 1B. I’m referring to Daniel Murphy of HLR, to be clear. Just as Murphy’s projection went way up overnight, Desmond’s projection went way down. He lost nearly 100 projected points and is now projected to amass as many points as someone named… *squints*… Austin Dean.
But as bad as this “trade” is for WTFS, it’s even worse somehow for Senior Squids. Not only did he not get the Rockies 1B. But instead, he has Eric Hosmer at an astounding cost of $32. Yes, that’s right, Eric Hosmer. Over the last full three seasons of baseball, Hosmer ranks second among all qualified hitters with a 58.2% ground ball rate. Only — OH SHIT! — Ian Desmond has a worse ground ball rate, at 58.6%. Sure, there’s some hope for Hosmer. Why, you ask? Here’s why: Hosmer has 5,070 career plate appearances. And as we all know, power comes later in the career. In fact, every power hitter in baseball history took more than 5,000 plate appearances to learn how to hit home runs. Barry Bonds had just four home runs at the 5,070 career plate appearances mark. He went on, as we all know, to hit 758 more from there. No bull, just facts.
Over the last two years, Eric Hosmer has hit 43 home runs. That’s 33 fewer than, oh… *draws name from hat*… Nelson Cruz, who by the way has hit 43 or more dingers in a single season twice. But he’s old and expensive (a whopping $8 more than Eric “Slow Roller to Short” Hosmer) though, and as we all know, we subtract points in this league based on age.
So in summation, I like this trade for HLR. Any time you can get the Rockies 1B instead of Ian Desmond or Eric Hosmer, you just have to do it.
Jordan’s thoughts: I’ve never heard of the two prospects in this “trade,” but Daniel Murphy seems good.
Andrew’s thoughts: I do not know if either of these players would have been kept or cut by their respective teams. Only Senior Squids truly knows that. Either way, here they are now, a bench hitter and a relief pitcher, traded for one another. And quite honestly, I’m riveted.
I think both teams are winners here, because both teams got to experience the magnificent rush of completing a trade.
Jordan’s thoughts: The moment Matt Adams signed with Washington and was no longer an option for the next COLORADO ROCKIES 1B, I stopped caring about him.
Andrew’s thoughts: I’m sorry Keith, but I don’t have a whole lot nice to say about this one. Hunter Renfroe has a ton of raw power and is $13 cheaper, but he’s got a sub-.300 OBP in almost 1,000 career plate appearances. He seems like a guy that only has a full time gig because the Padres don’t have any better option. In this league, I like him as more of a rotating UT2 guy or a back-up outfielder and wouldn’t feel great rolling him out as a daily starter.
I thought WTFS’ offense was in trouble after trading for Madison Bumgarner and I think this just makes it worse. According to Steamer, this is something like a 150 point downgrade for WTFS.
I like this trade for the Squids.
Jordan’s thoughts: I think there is some potential that Renfroe figures things out and ends up being pretty great. I see some shine potential. For that I don’t mind the trade for WTFS. I tend to agree with Bailey on all accounts. Clearly this is a great trade for Squids. The problem with low OBP guys in our league though is that they’re really boon or bust and can really sink weeks for you.
I’ll give this deal an “I love it” to the Squids…and for We Talk Fantasy Sports “I get it, but meh” ratings.
Andrew’s thoughts: I love this trade for Marshall Law so, so much. It reminds me of the real-life Nationals/Rays/Padres trade for Trea Turner, where the Nats basically crashed a trade between the Rays and Padres and came away with the most appealing talent. Marshall gave up what I see as four lukewarm assets (Taveras seems like a low power guy whose speed doesn’t matter as much in our scoring; the other three pieces are pure lotto tickets) to get back two young, cheap impact pieces in Nimmo and Winker and a decent flier on Lamet, who was solid in 2017 before requiring Tommy John. Honestly, I’d rather have Nimmo or Winker alone than Bumgarner at $60 to keep or the package WBFD received.
For WBFD though, I get it. At $60, Bumgarner was a very likely cut as we’ve seen his skills and health begin to descend, and now there are even rumors he may be traded out of his hugely favorable home park. Steamer projections have Bumgarner as the 17th highest scoring pitcher for 2019, but that honestly seems a little rich to me. I’m just a little surprised he didn’t get the Nimmo/Winker package here. But if you’re going to cut a guy anyway, getting four zero-cost pieces like this is clearly better long-term.
And as for We Talk Fantasy Sports, well, I applaud the continued aggressive addition to try and compete in 2019. First it was Corey Kluber, then Dallas Keuchel, now Bumgarner. Still, while their pitching is very, very much improved, I look at that offense and wonder if it can possibly keep up. Losing Nimmo and Winker gives them two pretty big starting hitting holes, in my opinion, and Bumgarner might need to be prime Mad-Bum just to offset that.
Jordan’s thoughts: My goal here is to be the creme filling in this turd sandwich of a trade review. Obviously I have a hard on for Jesse Winker who I drafted with my first round pick back in our first minor league draft. He seems good now and the Reds let Billy Hamilton go.
I agree that projections have soured on Madison Bumgarner and that is not completely hard to understand. However, I’ll disagree with with figurative “buns” and say that Bumgarner at $60 is more than fair and particularly attractive. I think if you’re on top and have a salary crunch, perhaps you have a different perspective on market value.
I love the trade for Marshall Law and We Talk Fantasy Sports here. Marshall Law showing how a rebuild in this league should work. You build a core with current rising talent vs sacking a whole number of seasons for a wish and a hope. Which is what I think the WBFDs has done here. I don’t mind turning MadBum into a bunch of pieces. But the draft picks aren’t helping you soon, and the prospects are okay. Perhaps you get a good pitcher and a decent outfielder out of it in a season or two and perhaps those prospects turn into something too. But, odds are actually against you.
I think with any game you want to position yourself to win and a key step is identifying your win condition(s). WTFS appears to have found theirs with identifying needing a front line starter to help sway weeks in a head-to-head format. It works. ML identified needing to acquire useful assets while still acquiring points. Say these guys blossom, and you’re a piece or two away, they have assets they could push the chips in. It can work. WBFD identified needing to wait another three years. Has that worked ever?
Hustle’s Toxic $0.02: Well this was a super fun trade. I think in all my years of playing fantasy sports I’ve seen very few if any other legit three way trades. So for that, I applaud the ability to pull it off. I am truly inspired.
For WFBD: I think Gaut did OK here if you subscribe to the notion that Bumgarner is in a big decline. Streamer projects a near 4 ERA, FIP, and XFIP for Bumgarner in 2019 which makes a $60 investment in that subpar to say the least. If Bumgarner gets traded those numbers would have to be worse, unless its to the Astros. If Bumgarner is the guy he is projected to be, then getting a couple pieces for him seems fine. Gaut will have $60 to spend on Mike Leake and Mike Leake accessories in the auction as well as a couple neat picks. I’m not a fan of Taveras (as I stated in the first Taveras deal this offseason), seems like a long shot in being better than a replacement level OF here. I do think I like Bukauskas better than most so thats cool too. Getting some assets for a guy who should be borderline be cut based on performance seems like a good idea. If Bumgarner bounces back, Gaut may wonder if he could have gotten a bit more.
For WTFS: As Bailey stated, Keith’s rotation is much improved. Even if Bumgarner isn’t peak he’s still startable almost every time out. The team’s rotation went from arguably worst to above average through a course of trades this offseason, so that is indeed commendable. The offense is a work in progress and will be more difficult to fill after giving away two cheap promising OFers. Choo and Blackmon are nice OFers to have, but after that it kinda falls off. 1b, 3b, one OF and 2 UTIL spots have to be occupied by Sano, Shaw, Desmond, Happ, Calhoun, I’m not sure who the next best hitter is after these 5. Having these guys as starters in your lineup seems incredibly risky since 4/5 of them were a minus at their position last year. Keith will have to find someway to supplant this either by trade or auction. This team at least had a direction now and with proper attention could push for a playoff spot.
For ML: There’s a lot to like here. Winker could potentially be the best asset in the whole trade. as a $3 cost controlled OF batting near the top of the Reds lineup. If las year is any indication he’s a very solid OF to have and if his power trends up he’s potentially a beast. I think Nimmo was obviously tremendously underrated going into last season and was one of the best pickups of the year, but I think he could be a tad overrated in 2019. That being said, he seems like he has the floor of being perfectly acceptable OF depth, which is valuable. I think getting the Lamet flier is the perfect thing a rebuilding team should be doing, ad as a 3rd piece of a deal, seems great. I think these 3 pieces are probably better than a 1/2 rounder and Bukauskas, not a guarantee, but I love the odds.
P Tyler Phillips (prospect)
P Ramon Rosso (prospect)
Jordan’s thoughts: I owned stock in Kendrys Morales late last season in a different league and he went on to hit homers in eight straight games during a playoff run. It was neat. Overall last season Morales was pretty poor for a 1B/UT player. He’s not expensive, not a drain on your roster, but apparently he hits better blind.
This deal literally cost Bailey nothing. These pitcher prospects boast FVs of 40 and 35+ and neither are top 20 for their respective teams. They’re below AA and while something could get them on the hype train, it’s not a shoe in.
I like this deal for Bailey. Even if he cuts Morales prior to the draft, he gave up nothing. If he keeps Morales, it probably means he got a decent haul for Nelson Cruz. Win win for him. I assume Keith sees something in one or both guys to be excited about the deal. If so great good for him too.
Hustle’s Toxic $.02
This is probably the worst trade off the offseason so far. Keith managed to trade away a much cheaper better Kendrys Morales for nothing while giving away some small but actual assets for a much more expensive much shittier Ian Desmond. I would rather have a 2nd round pick, Clint Frazier, OR Kendrys Morales than Ian Desmond, Ramon Rosso, or Tyler Phillip. It’s not even close really. If I had all 3 of the latter pieces, I would BUNDLE them for any one of the three former in a heartbeat.
The prospects here are truly useless. I can’t imagine what Bailey said or Keith read to have needed these guys. Between Rosso and Phillips you’re looking at a 20 % one of them is a bad pitcher in the majors in 2-3 years, which is an asset in abundance on the waiver wire. Meanwhile Morales has value as a bat who you can start at 1B or in either of your two utility spots vs righties. Morales had a monster 2nd half and while he’s no spring chicken and could decline, the price was right compared to other guys acquired this offseason for WTFS.
If you read my review of Kremer for Zimmerman, this is like that but worse because Keith paid assets earlier for a much worse and more expensive 1b than either Morales/Zimmerman and at the same time managed to get a worse pitching prospect than the 4th best Orioles pitching prospect. I’d have Kremer ahead of Rosso just because at least he’s in AA and was a Dodger at one point. In no way am I writing off the careers of Rosso or Phillips, heck I owned Phillips once, but these are no different than guys who can be picked up at will or with 5th round picks.
Organized Chaos trades away
Desmond, Ian 1B/LF $28
We Talk Fantasy Sports trades away 2020 Draft Pick, Round 2 (We Talk Fantasy Sports)
Frazier, Clint OF $3 (Year 2 cost controlled)
Hustle’s Toxic $.02 Like Jordan, Keith is also making up for last year’s mistake. Last year Keith left a lot of money on the table. This year? He’s spending it on Sano, Desmond, Kluber, and others. It’s certainly a better strategy than last year and I’m confident his team will be better. That being said, Ian Desmond costs 28 bucks and barely had an OBP over 300. His WRC + was under 90. This is not the kind of player you want to pay a decent chunk for at 1B/LF.
I do however like this trade more for Swinson. At some point, Swinson is going to run out of minor league spots to utilize, but he’s making good use of them here with a major league ready Frazier who I’d consider a decent buy low guy. Swinson has money so wasting $3 on Frazier who might not play a ton this year isn’t a big deal. Frazier is still projected to be a pretty good power hitter with a decent hit tool, it’s just a matter of time before he finds a spot. 2nd round picks have some value in this league, so it’s nice to acquire one. Losing Desmond shouldn’t be a big deal considering his age, price, production, and where Chaos’ team is right now.
Bottom line, I feel like Keith could have used the 3 bucks on Frazier, spent the leftover 25 on similar or better production than Desmond, and kept his 2nd round pick next year. There’s players who have already been cut who I think aren’t a huge step down, if any, from Desmond that should be less than 25, even in our poopy auction.
Andrew’s Thoughts: I don’t have much to add other than to point out that Ian Desmond‘s horrible offensive numbers came… WHILE HE PLAYED HIS HOME GAMES AT COORS FIELD. That’s kind of unforgiveable.
As a Nationals fan, I’ll always have an affinity for Ian Desmond. And I’m not strictly opposed to adding roughly $30 to a budget to bet on a bounceback from a player. But Ian Desmond doesn’t have that high a ceiling to begin with. If he bounces back to a .325 wOBA, you’ve still invested too much. I just think he’s a cut and an overpaid, below average fantasy asset. I like this deal for Swinson.
TBD trades away
3B Miguel Sano ($41+)
We Talk Fantasy Sports trades away
2019 2nd Round Pick
Andrew’s Thoughts: I like that WTFS is adding pieces to compete. I think Miguel Sano was pretty clearly a cut though and keeping him at $41+ is steep. He was great in 2017 but struck out a ton and was awful in 2018. If you get 2017 Sano, it’s worth it. If you get 2018 Sano, it’s not. Of course, for a second round pick, who even cares? WTFS could have something better come along between now and auction, cut bait, and be out a likely shitpick. That wouldn’t be so terrible.
As it stands now, the auction just lost one more interesting name. I can see the money being left on the table now.
I find it simply wonderful that WTFS is once again paying big money to a disappointing Twins prospect.
Jordan’s Thoughts: I weirdly thing Sano probably goes for something similar to $30-40 in the draft. He’s projected to be a $5-15 player, but what if the projections are wrong? It isn’t a huge reach to see Sano back in the form of 2017. Assuming his personal issues are cleared up, and his starting job is cemented, he’ll have the opportunity.
Its a pretty big gamble. But, Sano is 25 and has done it before. I’m not cheering for him, but that matters little. I’ll give the winner and participation ribbon of the trade to WTFS.